Gary Gilley on the Emergent Church

This is one of the best overviews of the Emergent Church movement I have read yet, written by Gary Gilley.
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"The emergent church is a rather slippery name for a rather slippery movement. By slippery, I mean that the movement is so new, so fragmented, so varied, that nailing it down is like nailing the proverbial Jell-O to the wall."
CONTINUE READING...

A Great Privilege

"It is a great privilege to hear the gospel. You may smile and think there is nothing very great in it. The damned in hell know. Oh, what would they give if they could hear the gospel now? If they could come back and entertain but the shadow of a hope that they might escape from the wrath to come?

The saved in heaven estimate this privilege at a high rate, for, having obtained salvation through the preaching of this gospel, they can never cease to bless their God for calling them by his word of truth. O that you knew it! On your dying beds the listening to a gospel sermon will seem another thing than it seems now."

--Charles Spurgeon

Remember Our Soldiers

" The brave man inattentive to his duty, is worth little more to his country, than the coward who deserts her in the hour of danger."

--Lt. General Thomas Stonewall Jackson

Thanks for your sacrifices. God has used you in great ways to bring freedom and liberty to millions of Americans.

Myspace Smut

Do you have teenage kids? If so are you aware of MySpace? If you are not sure what MySpace is, it is a personal website where kids can chat with their friends, post information about themselves with animated graphics, quizzes, profiles with the ability to customize their information with just about any graphic they want...and I mean just about ANY.

Just by perusing through Myspace of random christian kids I happen to know, I was astonished at the content of some of the material I saw. Granted, some kids do not have foul language or soft porn pictures on their myspace site, for which I am very thankful, however the amount of profanity, explicit graphics, and semi-pornographic content I saw on many of the kids' sites kind of shocked me. Some of this content was on the Myspace sites of "friends" who have been invited to be on their list, enabling them to contact each other but some of the profanity and explicit content was also on sites of some of these "christian" church kids. I cannot count how many times I saw the "F" word "B" word, the "N" word, the "SH" word, and the "A" word as though for many of these kids it's just the normal way of speaking, which I guess it is. Or how many kids decide to post pictures of themselves flipping a bird or seductively dressed, this also includes shirtless boys with their pants hanging off their hips, I guess they think they're sexy.

One site had a nice little greeting of "He is Risen-Happy Easter" which I thought was really nice then I scrolled down only to find a cartoon showing a series of pictures of a man's private parts with "funny" little sayings about the sexual activities it engages in...if you know what I mean. Then there was the illustrated picture of a naked body-builder, with exaggerated externals, showing off everything-with the caption: "This is what happens when you mix steroids with Viagra". I'm sure you can figure out what the graphics looked like. Or how about the animated cartoon graphic of a woman stripping and when she becomes totally naked you discover it's actually a man in the lower regions. I felt uncomfortable looking at these sites and thought (if my wife walked in the room right now she would think I'm looking at internet porn) but the truth of the matter is I was simply seeing what was on some of these kid's Myspace.

One of the features is a section where kids can take quizzes–––Blogthings Quizzes. This helps identify things about them, their personalities, likes and dislikes. Below is an example of the quizzes kids can take. By the way this doesn't really have any age restrictions.

What Kind of Seducer Are You?

What Song Should You Strip To?

What's Your Porn Star Name?

I realize a lot of kids have a Myspace account. Many of these kids also have no desire to be raunchy or filthy when posting information about themselves or selecting graphics to decorate their site with but what happens is that they are consistently taking a ride through the streets and avenues of a city called Sodom. You're basically just a couple of clicks away from some very raunchy sites. I know there are many christian kids with a Myspace account who are not comfortable with the surrounding content contained in some of the free-graphics sites or the subject matter on the sites of some of their invited friends. However, it's like you say to your friend "hey let's meet for lunch...OK where do you want to go?...um... there's this really nice little cafe in middle of the red-light district in Amsterdam." I know, "we won't stop at any of the porn shops or anything" but every day you'll have to pass by them on your way to the cafe. Or it's like the guy who goes surfing at South Beach (Miami Beach) where all the topless sunbathers are. He isn't going there to see the topless women (of which there are a lot) he's just going there for the waves (of which there are little). Why put youself in a position to be tempted so?

I've got a bad hunch that in many cases these Myspace sites actually expose what is in the hearts and minds of some of these kids. Why else would they deliberately decide to place certain graphics on their site or use explicit language?

What I would really like to know is, if you're a christian kid who has a Myspace, why wouldn't you use your Myspace site to proclaim God's good news of forgiveness of sins? Why wouldn't a christian kid be the light set on a hill in the midst of total darkness?

What about having nothing to do with deeds of darkness but rather expose them to the light of God's righteousness, since the days are evil and we should be wise and careful how we live?

What about kids living by the Spirit so as not to gratify sinful desires which include sexual immorality and impurity among other things?

Kids, like all christians we need to be separate from the world.

The bible says to not love the world or the things in it and if you love the world, the love of the Father is not in you. Does that mean if you love the world maybe you're not a christian?--Yes.

Kids need to think on good things as it says in Philippians.

There's enough garbage out there without christian kids contributing to it. Worldliness seems like a tsunami in the world of teenagers.

That internet is like this surreal subculture universe full of temptations and snares just waiting to pounce upon any young unsuspecting sheep but it also can be used as a tool to spread a message of hope through Jesus Christ to a world in darkness and on it's way to hell.

-KTO

Why God Permits False Prophets

This was originally posted on Slice of Laodicea. I thought it was so good I would post it here.

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"You shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams. For the Lord your God is testing you, to know whether you love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul". (Deuteronomy 13:3).

From those words it is clear that God allows teachers of error for the same reason as He does persecutors of His people: to test their love, to try their fidelity, to show that their loyalty to him is such that they will not give ear unto His enemies.

Error has always been more popular than the Truth, for it lets down the bars and fosters fleshly indulgence, but for that very reason it is obnoxious to the godly. The one who by grace can say "I have chosen the way of Truth" will be able to add "I have stuck unto Thy testimonies" (Psalm 119:30, 31), none being able to move him therefrom.
"For there must be factions among you in order that those who are genuine among you may be recognized." (1 Corinthians 11:19).

Error serves as a flail, separating the chaff from the wheat. Let some plausible and popular preacher come forward with an old error decked out in new clothes and empty professors will at once flock to his standard; but not so with those who are established in the Faith. Thus, by means of the false prophets, God makes it appear who are the ones who hold the Truth in sincerity: they are faithful to Him despite all temptations to turn away unto a "broader-minded" way. The genuine gold endures every test to which it is subjected. Thus too are the unregenerate "converts" revealed: the counterfeit gold will not withstand the fire. Those who are attracted by a novelty do not endure but are soon carried away by some newer innovation.

--AW Pink, Sermon on the Mount

Are We Pharisees?

It seems like every time you take a dogmatic position on a biblical issue there are critics ready to pounce upon you with the accusation of "Pharisee". This has been occurring here lately on thinkerup.com. I'm not worried about it. I believe these people hurling these accusations are not clear on the errors of the pharisees and why Jesus came down so hard on them.

Below is an excerpt from John MacArthur's book, Reckless Faith. Hopefully this could help clarify some of the confusion for those who are quick to attach the label of pharisee to anyone who takes an authoritative doctrinal position on an issue based on scripture. Isn't that what we are supposed to do as christians?

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"Sometimes the Pharisees are accused of having been overly concerned with orthodoxy. But that was not at all where they went astray. Their error was that they became so wrapped up in their own traditions that they downplayed the truth of Scripture and distorted sound doctrine. Far from being theologically orthodox, they had simply invented their own traditions and used a man-made system to nullify the truth of divinely inspired Scripture
(Matt. 15:3-6).

It is fashionable today to characterize anyone who is concerned with biblical doctrine as Pharisaical. The biblical condemnation of the Pharisees' legalism has been misread as a denunciation of doctrinal precision. And love of the truth has often been judged inherently legalistic.

But love for truth is not the same as legalism. The fact that it has been portrayed that way has sabotaged the very thing the church so desperately needs today. Too many Christians are content to gaze nonchalantly at the surface of scriptural truth without plunging any deeper. They often justify their shallow indifference as a refusal to be legalistic. Conversely, they dismiss as pharisaical narrow-mindedness, any attempt to declare the truth authoritatively.

Doctrine divides; therefore any concern for doctrinal matters is commonly seen as unchristian. People concerned with discernment and sound doctrine are often accused of fostering a pharisaical, divisive attitude. But that is exactly backwards! True unity is rooted in truth.

Jesus prayed: "Sanctify them in the truth; Thy word is truth... For their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth. I do not ask in behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; that they may all be one" (John 17:17-21). The unity for which He prayed is preceded by and grows out of sanctification in the truth. Fellowship that ignores or glosses over the crucial doctrines of the faith is not Christian unity; it is ungodly compromise.

As doctrine has been de-emphasized, the church has moved from preaching the Word to other activities: drama, music, entertainment - things designed to evoke an emotional response rather than enlighten the mind.

All this has accelerated the move away from doctrine and focused the pulpit message on everything but the objective truth of Scripture. Preachers have become comedians, storytellers, therapists, showmen, and entertainers rather than powerful envoys of divine truth. . . .

One reason for the low level of discernment in the church today is the reluctance to take a definitive stand on any issue. Those with any convictions at all are supposed to hold those beliefs with as much slack as possible. Dogmatism is not permitted. To pronounce anything true and call its antithesis error is to challenge society's only remaining dogma. Refuse to equivocate on any point of principle or doctrine, and you will be labeled too narrow. Zeal for the truth has become politically incorrect."

--John MacArthur, Reckless faith: When the church loses its will to discern

INCLUSIVE CONVERSATION

According to Tony Jones, all kinds of perspectives are part of the Emergent "conversation". A conversation which is attempting to redefine our christian faith, I might add.

"Within Emergent are Texas Baptists who don't allow women to preach and New England lesbian Episcopal priests. We have Southern California YWAMers and Midwest Lutherans. We have those who hold to biblical inerrancy, and others trying to demythologize the scripture. We have environmental, peacenik lefties, "crunchy cons," and right wing hawks."

--Tony Jones, Is Emergent the New Christian Left? Tony Jones responds to the critics, May 23, 2006

You can read the post HERE.

This is another example of unity being more highly esteemed than doctrinal truth. This is one of the biggest problems with the Emergent church crowd.

How can you have lesbians and those challenging the authority of scripture as part of your so called "christian" conversation... even worse, a conversation questioning the fundamental beliefs of the christian faith?

The more I read on the Emergent church the more apostate they appear to be becoming.

We need to pray the Holy Spirit will open christians' eyes to the many errors in the Emergent movement.

-KTO

Tossed Here and There

"Do not follow the leadership of people who are themselves "tossed here and there by waves, and carried about by every wind of doctrine" (Eph. 4:14). Find and follow leaders who display an ability to discern, to analyze and refute error, to teach the Scriptures clearly and accurately. Read from authors who prove themselves careful handlers of divine truth. Listen to preachers who rightly divide the Word of Truth. Expose yourself to the teaching of people who think critically, analytically, and carefully. Learn from people who understand where error has attacked the church historically.

Place yourself under the tutelage of those who serve as watchmen of the church. I do this myself. There are certain authors who have demonstrated skill in handling the Word and whose judgment I have come to trust. When I encounter a difficult issue - whether it is a theological problem, an area of controversy, a new teaching I have never heard before, or whatever - I turn to these authors first to see what they have to say. I wouldn't seek help from an unreliable source or a marginal theologian. I want to know what those who are skilled in exposing error and gifted in presenting truth have to say.

There have been outstanding men of discernment in virtually every era of church history. ... we would do well to emulate the clarity with which they spoke the truth against error. Those who can expose and answer the errors of false teachers are set in the body of Christ to assist us all to think critically and clearly. Learn from them."

-- John MacArthur,
Reckless faith - When the church loses its will to discern

"Theological Jellyfish"

“I have no love for men who have no distinct opinions, theological jellyfish without bones, brains, teeth or claws”

-J.C. Ryle
“Church on Fire” by Roger Steer, p.197

In light of the above quote by J.C. Ryle, I would like to recommend THIS SERMON by Ian Paisley-Fundamentalism vs. Apostasy for anyone who is tired of wimpy preachers who are afraid to take a stand. Do we need anymore "soft voice sissy, pulpit ornaments"?

Am I the only one tired of preachers holding back on proclaiming the Word of God with boldness?

This is like drinking water in the spiritual desert when I hear men like Ian Paisley preach. It's so opposite of how Brian McLaren or Rob Bell preaches. The difference is, Ian Paisley speaks GOD'S TRUTH with boldness, while so many others today just waffle in the winds of cultural "relevance". (I'm so sick of that word).

Thank God for Ian Paisley and real men like him.

-KTO

Mixture of Counterfeit with Truth

"It is by the mixture of counterfeit religion with true, not discerned and distinguished, that the devil has had his greatest advantage against the cause and kingdom of Christ. It is by this means, principally, that he has prevailed against all revivings of religion, since the first founding of the Christian church.

... it greatly concerns us to use our utmost endeavors, clearly to discern, and have it well settled and established, wherein true religion does consist. Till this be done, it may be expected that great revivals of religion will be but of short continuance; till this be done, there is but little good to be expected of all our warm debates, in conversation and from the press, not knowing clearly and distinctly what we ought to contend for."

--Jonathan Edwards, from the Preface to A TREATISE CONCERNING RELIGIOUS AFFECTIONS

Brian McBlurren, Bologna Campolo, Slick Warren

When leaders such as Brian McBlurr-en (McLaren) or Rob-Nooma-Yoga-Breathe in the Spirit Bell, or Bologna (Tony) Campolo, or Richard (call me a mystic) Foster, or Slick Warren or Robert Fool-Yer (Schuller) or whomever, STRAYS from the essential doctrines of:

-the deity of Christ
-the sacrificial blood atonement
-the virgin birth
-the Trinity
-doctrine of exclusive salvation
-from the infallible scripture alone
-through Jesus alone
-through faith alone
-by grace alone
-in Christ alone
-to the glory of God alone
-the resurrection
-the reality of hell

or any other essential doctrine, you should pray from them and flee from them, their churches, their books, and their preaching as fast as you can. Wherever and whenever this occurs, that teacher has shown himself to be one who is a FALSE TEACHER and has no business teaching the Holy Scriptures. This teacher has then poisoned the Truth of God.

Test all things (pertaining to the faith), hold on to the good (doctrinally sound) and flee from all forms of evil (ALL teachings or methods that do not pass the test of scripture). 1 Thess. 5:21, 22.

Like Ian Paisley says, you should: "STAND UP, SHOUT OUT, GET OUT, STAY OUT!"

-KCO

YOUR PASTOR: A FALSE PROPHET?

Could your pastor actually be a false prophet or teacher?

Scripture gives us a criterion for a reason. With so many church growth philosophies and church reinvention trends going on today, many pastors have inadvertently fallen into the trap of falsehood in their teachings and techniques and how they "do church". When was the last time you took a serious hard look at what's going on in your church?

Jeremiah chapter 23 gives us a picture of a false prophet or teacher. Do these descriptions apply to your pastor? If so, you should seek God's direction in prayer and have a serious talk with your church leadership:

-Does he scatter the flock, driving members away? (vs. 1, 2)

-Does he neglect to bestow care for the believers? (vs. 2)

-Does he give the flock false hope? (vs. 16)

-Does he speak visions from his own mind and not from scripture? (vs. 16)

-Does he say to those who despise God "You will have peace"? (vs. 17)

-Does he neglect to warn the people of God's judgment? (vs. 17)

-Does he run with his own message, preaching from his own mind and not from scripture? (vs. 21)

-Does he speak of his own dreams for the church and not God's dreams? (vs.21, 25, 26)

-Does he come up with new methods or techniques not from scripture? (vs. 25)

-Does he boast and brag of his own goals and plans for the church? (vs.27, 28)

-Does he get his sermons and teachings from sources other than the Holy Spirit through scripture? (vs. 28)

-Is he reckless and careless with plans for the future of the church? (vs. 32)

-KCO

We Corrupt the Word of God

We corrupt the Word of God when we make defective statements of doctrine.

"We do so when we add to the Bible the opinions of the Church, or of the Church Fathers, as if they were of equal authority. We do so when we take away from the Bible, for the sake of pleasing men; or, from a feeling of false liberality, keep back any statement which seems narrow, and harsh, or hard. We do so when we try to soften down anything that is taught about eternal punishment, or the reality of hell. We do so when we bring forward doctrines in their wrong proportions. We all have our favorite doctrines, and our minds are so constituted that it is hard to see one truth very clearly without forgetting that there are other truths equally important. We must not forget the exhortation of Paul, to minister "according to the proportion of faith." We do so when we exhibit an excessive anxiety to fence, and guard, and qualify such doctrines as justification by faith without the deeds of the law, for fear of the charge of antinomianism; or when we flinch from strong statements about holiness, for fear of being thought legal. We also do this when we shrink back from the use of Bible language in giving an account of doctrines.

We are apt to keep back such expressions as "born again," "election," "adoption," "conversion," "assurance," and to use a roundabout phraseology, as if we were ashamed of plain Bible words."

-J.C. Ryle, August 1858

The 'Sensuous' Christian

Jim from Slice posted this quote from R.C. Sproul. I thought it accurately applies to so many christians today. I think it ties in well with the post "I Want to Feeeeel God".

The 'Sensuous' Christian

The sensuous Christian is one who lives by his feelings rather through his understanding of the Word of God. The sensuous Christian cannot be moved to service, prayer or study unless he "feels like it". His Christian life is only as effective as the intensity of present feelings. When he experiences spiritual euphoria, he is a whirlwind of Godly activity; when he is depressed, he is spiritually incompetent. He constantly seeks new and fresh spiritual experiences and uses them to determine the Word of God. His "inner feelings" become the ultimate test of truth.
The sensuous Christian doesn't need to study the Word of God because he already knows the will of God by his feelings. He doesn't want to know God; he wants to experience him.
--Knowing Scripture, R.C. Sproul

Mystics Misuse of Scripture

Thanks Ken from Apprising Ministries for linking THIS POST on Slice of Laodicea showing how those promoting contemplative prayer are misusing scripture.

This will be a nice addition to the "Contemplative Snare Collection".

-KTO

A Perfect Love-by Tim Challies

How many times have you heard a person claim that he has "accepted Jesus as his personal Lord and Savior?" Have you ever asked him what it means that Jesus is his Lord? Have you ever asked him how Jesus is his Savior? What makes Him his Savior? And what does it mean that He is his personal Lord and Savior?

How many times have you heard a person open a prayer with the words "Dear God?" What do those words really mean? Are they addressing God or addressing a letter? Why do we begin our prayers with an address? Is this necessary or merely custom?

How many times have you heard a person thank God that Jesus is present, for "where two are more are gathered together, Jesus is there?" Have you ever asked him why Jesus is only there where two or more are gathered? Have you ever asked if He is present in a more special way when people are gathered versus when they are alone?

There are so many times we flippantly speak of God and His attributes without even caring to understand what we are saying. So we really understand what it means to address God and to bring ourselves into His presence? Do we understand what it means that "Jesus is there?" Do we even care to know what it means that Jesus is my Lord and my Savior?

The incredible thing is that we don't need to understand these things to be God's children. We do not need to devote ourselves to endless studies in theology and doctrine in order to be saved. God sees and knows and values the heart more than the mind. Yet if we want to grow deeper in our love for God, we need to begin to understand these things. We need to grow deeper in our knowledge of Him.

On that day that I got married, I loved my wife deeply. On our wedding day, as I looked at her walking down the aisle towards me, I never would have believed that I could love her more than I did at that very moment. I had known her for four years and had spent thousands of hours just being with her, listening to her talk and watching her interact with other people. And now she was walking towards me, looking absolutely radiant, and intending to pledge her life to me. I began to sob like a child and felt my heart would nearly burst with the love I felt for her. But you know what? Almost eight years into that marriage I can honestly say I love her more now than I did when we got married. Why is that? It is simply that I know her so much better now. The more I learn about her, the more I know her. The more I know her, the more I love her.

I use that illustration to show that you can really only love God inasmuch as you know Him. When you are an unbeliever and do not know God you cannot love Him at all. When some day you die and go to be with Him, you will know Him in a perfect way, and will accordingly love Him in a perfect way. The time between when you come to love Him and you are called to be with Him is your opportunity to experience that love and get just a foretaste of heaven here on earth.

I love God more now than I did when I first believed. As a child I loved God with a childlike love, but I barely knew Him. I can think back to distinct moments as I grew older when God taught me something new and amazing about Himself. I can remember moments where something hit me like a lightning bolt and I was awakened to a new reality about God that I had not known before. There were times when my whole body broke into chills as I grew in my knowledge of my Creator. There were other times when I broke into tears as I began to realize the necessity of Christ's sacrifice for me or the vast depths of His love for me. As I learned about my God I learned to love Him more. As I learned about my God I had to love Him more!

You can be a believer and know almost nothing about God. The man who hung on the cross beside Christ new little more than that Christ was the Son of God and that God had forgiven his sins. And that was enough. But if you want to love God more you need to know Him more. I know that I'm a mere preschooler when it comes to knowing God. I look at others and see some who are in primary school, some who are in high school and some who must be about ready to finish up their post-graduate studies. And how I yearn to know Him that much, knowing that the love I feel for Him now, as great as it may be, is nothing more than a child's love! I long to love Him, and therefore long to know Him. And I look forward to the day when I will know Him even as I am known by Him, that I may love Him with the perfect love with which He loves me.

-Tim Challies
challies.com

IRREVERENCE

After viewing THIS VIDEO on Slice of Laodicea's site, I came across THIS ONE too–White Boy DJ.

This kind of reminds me of the church I used to be a member of last year when the youth pastor got up during the offertory and did a rap. That was the last time my family and I attended that church. That's something which will be covered at another time.

I guess any fear of God or respect for his word have completely been thrown out the window. Nothing is sacred. Everything is game.

Ecclesiastes 5:1-3

"Guard your steps when you go to the house of God. Go near to listen rather than to offer the sacrifice of fools, who do not know that they do wrong.

Do not be quick with your mouth,
do not be hasty in your heart
to utter anything before God.
God is in heaven
and you are on earth,
so let your words be few.

As a dream comes when there are many cares,
so the speech of a fool when there are many words."

I actually get sad when I see these things. Not because I am super-spiritual, but because the first thing I realize when I come before God is his holiness and my nothingness and I am awed by Him. Things like this show no honor, respect, or fear of God of whom it says in Lamentations 3:22--Because of the LORD's great love we are not consumed, for his compassions never fail.

-KTO

Spiritual Formation & Small Groups

YIKES!!!

THIS looks like a deadly combination (spiritually speaking). Small groups teaching Spiritual Disciplines Richard Foster style. I hope this doesn't catch on in America...or has it already?

I don't have a huge problems with small groups per se as long as they are based on the study of scripture rather than touchy-feely group therapy or as long as there is not a deliberate attempt to create a "group-think" consensus of arriving at biblical truth. Although I think a real small group should be your family. I do have a problem with a small group engaging in the practice of "spiritual disciplines" taught by Richard Foster.

Is THIS one of the things which will be taught from Richard Foster?

Wow...what ever happened to good old-fashioned bible study and prayer?

-KTO

Brian McLaren on The DaVinci Code

The more I read from Brian McLaren the more I am convinced he is completely out of his mind. There are so many whacked-out things he says in THIS BRIEF INTERVIEW that I do not even know where to start. It's like trying to help your kid clean his room and as you survey the damage you become aware of the fact that the mess is so horrendous you are overwelmed and you do not even know where to begin.

This is the feeling I get anytime I read McLaren.

McLaren finds good from The DaVinci Code. He seems to have more positive things to say about the heresies in this book than negative. He also spends more time criticizing the contemporary evangelical christian church than he does Dan Brown.

Below is an excerpt from the interview.

"Ultimately, The Da Vinci Code is telling us important things about the image of Jesus that is being portrayed by the dominant Christian voices. [Readers] don't find that satisfactory, genuine, or authentic, so they're looking for something that seems more real and authentic."

-Brian McLaren
an excerpt from Brian McLaren on The Da Vinci Code
Interview by Lisa Ann Cockrel, 5-9-06 from Sojomail

-KTO

Awed by a View of God's Majesty

"The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom" (Prov. 1:7). Happy the soul that has been awed by a view of God's majesty, that has had a vision of God's awful greatness, His ineffable holiness, His perfect righteousness, His irresistible power, His sovereign grace. Does someone say,"But it is only the unsaved, those outside of Christ, who need to fear God"? Then the sufficient answer is that the saved, those who are in Christ, are admonished to work out their own salvation with "fear and trembling." Time was when it was the general custom to speak of a believer as a "God-fearing man." That such an appellation has become nearly extinct only serves to show whither we have drifted. Nevertheless, it still stands written, "Like as a father pitieth his children, so the Lord pitieth them that fear Him" (Psalm 103:13).

When we speak of godly fear, of course we do not mean a servile fear, such as prevails among the heathen in connection with their gods. No, we mean that spirit which Jehovah is pledged to bless, that spirit to which the prophet referred when he said, "To this man will I (the Lord) look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word" (Isa. 66:2). It was this the apostle had in view when he wrote, "Honor all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king" (I Pet: 2:17). And nothing will foster this godly fear like a recognition of the Sovereign Majesty of God."

-A.W. Pink

Men Kissing in Church

Careful, if you go to Dan Kimball's Vintage Faith emergent church another guy might kiss you during the service. It may even be Dan Kimball:

"Ron the conga player was standing near me and he joked about the announcement of the "holy kiss". I said, "here it comes!" and gave him a nice peck on his cheek - of which he recieved and then recoiled back not knowing how to respond. After the greeting time, I then proudly announced to everyone there as I began the message, that I had my first holy kiss."

Yet another reason why I avoid this whole Emergent church movement like a plague. You never know what may happen next.

-KTO

Add Another Campolo Quote...

Already?

In THIS POST from May 5th, I made a comment at the end about finding more Campolo quotes to convince someone to avoid Tony Campolo. I had no idea I would stumble upon another outrageous quote from Campolo today. This should cause any christian to stop and consider... where in the world is this guy coming from with comments such as these?

You can read the interviews yourself, they are very short. There are two parts. Later we'll take a look at some of the heretical things uttered by Brian McLaren which in some cases are even more confusing than Campolo's. The interview referred to below is of McLaren and Campolo together.

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"What I think we can say is, and this is where I get into trouble, I’m not so sure that when this life is over that all possibilities for salvation are over."

-Tony Campolo
Out of Ur "Brian McLaren’s Inferno: the provocative church leader explains his view of hell"-May 05, 2006

This stuff is getting hard to keep up with.

-KTO

RICHARD FOSTER & ASTRAL PROJECTION

Richard Foster's 1978 edition of CELEBRATION OF DISCIPLINE promotes Astral Projection.

From the Witch Craft Magic website, read how this site describes Astral Projection. Then read Richard Foster's section he removed from his 1978 version of his book. It is pretty much the same thing.

DISCLAIMER--CAUTION! STOP: THIS IS A DEMONIC PRACTICE FORBIDDEN BY GOD (See Deut. 18:10, 14 Lev. 19:26).

What is Astral Projection?
Astral Projection is the process of temporarily separating your consciousness or spirit from your physical body. It is an extraordinary experience. All who have experienced it can testify to its lucidity and magical quality. Astral Travel is very different from normal dreaming. In fact, it seems even more clear than our normal daily lives; our senses seem sharper and the environment somehow more real. It is often thought that Astral Projection (Out-of-Body Experiences) is only experienced by people that have had a near death experience after an accident or on the operating table.

• In the Astral the sky is not the limit. One can fly way beyond the blue sky, into deep space exploring the planets. One can consciously project to any part of the world through concentration...
• We can fly through the air, having a birds eye view of what is below, traveling across the surface of our huge planet...
• Imagine being able to glide over the ocean like a seagull, or being able to penetrate into it and breathe beneath it like a fish...
• We can meet enlightened beings, even of distant ancient traditions, which can help guide us along the Spiritual Path. Or we can even attend true esoteric schools and temples to learn much about the mysteries of life and death...

~ ~ ~
Now look at the section removed from Richard Foster's 1978 edition of the "Celebration of Discipline" book which is instructing the dangerous new age practice of Astral Projection, thanks to Ken Silva from Apprising Ministries for pointing this out:

“A fourth form of meditation has as its objective to bring you into a deep inner communion with the Father where you look at Him and He looks at you. In your imagination, picture yourself walking along a lovely forest path. Take your time, allowing the blaring noise of our modern megalopolis to be overtaken by the sound of rustling leaves and cool forest streams. After observing yourself for a bit, take the perspective of one walking, rather than the one observed. Try to feel the breeze upon your face as if it were gently blowing away all anxiety. Stop along the way to ponder the beauty of flowers and birds. When you are able to experience the scene with all your senses, the path breaks onto a lovely grassy knoll. Walk out into the lush large meadow for a time, lie down on your back staring up at blue sky and white clouds. Enjoy the sights and smells. Thank the Lord for the beauty.”

“After awhile there is a deep yearning within to go into the upper regions beyond the clouds. In your imagination allow your spiritual body, shining with light, to rise out of your physical body. Look back so that you can see yourself lying in the grass and reassure your body that you will return momentarily. Imagine your spiritual self, alive and vibrant, rising up through the clouds and into the stratosphere. Observe your physical body, the knoll, and the forest shrink as you leave the earth. Go deeper and deeper into outer space until there is nothing except the warm presence of the eternal Creator. Rest in His presence. Listen quietly, anticipating the unanticipated."

Richard Foster has not issued any explanation as to why he removed this section from the 1978 edition of his book. If he has repented of the sin of promoting this form of witchcraft, he should make it known.

People need to wake up and realize what is going on here. How long will christians "FLIRT" with this latest deceptive tool of the devil's called Contemplative Spirituality?

-KCO (Keith)
-KTO (Kenny)

TONY CAMPOLO QUOTES

Some christian leaders look up to Tony Campolo. What's even more scary is that some christian youth pastors look up to him and consider Campolo to be a mentor of theirs. I get nervous when I realize this. I know of one youth pastor in particular who has made this statement, that Tony Campolo was his mentor. I have heard this youth pastor reference Campolo on more than one occasion while addressing the youth.

How is a parent to know how much of Campolo's teachings are trickling down through their youth pastors to the teenagers as these teenagers attempt to learn true biblical doctrine through a trusted youth pastor?

If you're a parent or a teenager whose youth pastor mentions his admiration for Tony Campolo please take a look at some of these quotes of his and you let me know if you're comfortable with anyone looking up to Tony Campolo as a mentor or as a christian leader:

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"Beyond these models of reconciliation, a theology of mysticism provides some hope for common ground between Christianity and Islam. Both religions have within their histories examples of ecstatic union with God, which seem at odds with their own spiritual traditions but have much in common with each other."

-Tony Campolo
(Page 149, Speaking My Mind)

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"I am saying that there is no salvation apart from Jesus; that's my evangelical mindset. However, I am not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians"

-Tony Campolo
(National Liberty Journal, 8/99)

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"...what can I say to an Islamic brother who has fed the hungry, and clothed the naked? You say, "But he hasn't a personal relationship with Christ." I would argue with that. And I would say from a Christian perspective, in as much as you did it to the least of these you did it unto Christ. You did have a personal relationship with Christ, you just didn't know it."

-Tony Campolo
EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne

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"We cannot allow our theologies to separate us" (speaking on the relations between Muslims and Christians)

-Tony Campolo
EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne

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"What can we learn about that kind of spirituality that can help us find common ground? No theological statements were made, no compromising beliefs, no attempts to come to a common denominator. And yet, a kind of spiritual oneness.

That's the place where we come together, in common need and common suffering, as we reach out to one another in love, leaving judgment in the hands of God, sharing out of our own faith. I mean the last thing we are asking in those times is—is your theology the same as mine?—and vice-versa. All of the sudden in the hour of suffering there is a commonality. And that's where we meet. It's in mystical spirituality and in communal mutuality that's where we come together."

-Tony Campolo
EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne

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"It seems to me that when we listen to the Muslim mystics as they talk about Jesus and their love for Jesus, I must say, it's a lot closer to New Testament Christianity than a lot of the Christians that I hear. In other words if we are looking for common ground, can we find it in mystical spirituality, even if we cannot theologically agree, Can we pray together in such a way that we connect with a God that transcends our theological differences?"

-Tony Campolo
EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne

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""Beyond these models of reconciliation, a theology of mysticism provides some hope for common ground between Christianity and Islam. Both religions have within their histories examples of ecstatic union with God ... I do not know what to make of the Muslim mystics, especially those who have come to be known as the Sufis. What do they experience in their mystical experiences? Could they have encountered the same God we do in our Christian mysticism?"

-Tony Campolo
"Speaking My Mind", pages 149-150

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"Jesus is the only Savior, but not everybody who is being saved by Him is aware that He is the one who is doing the saving"

-Tony Campolo
EP News Service, Oct. 4, 1985

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"...during times of reflection I sensed that believing in Jesus and living out His teachings just wasn't enough. There was a yearning for something more, and I found that I was increasingly spiritually gratified as I adopted older ways of praying--ways that have largely been ignored by those of us in the Protestant tradition. Counter-Reformation saints like Ignatius of Loyola have become important sources of help as I have begun to learn from them modes of contemplative prayer. I practice what is known as "centering prayer," in which a sacred word is repeated as a way to be in God's presence."

-Tony Campolo
"Mystical Encounters for Christians"
www.beliefnet.com

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"I've got to push everything out of mind save the name of Jesus. I say His name over and over again, for as long as fifteen minutes, until I find my soul suspended in what the ancient Celtic Christians called a "thin place"--a state where the boundary between heaven and earth, divine and human, dissolves. You could say that I use the name of Jesus as my koan."

-Tony Campolo
"Mystical Encounters for Christians"
www.beliefnet.com

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"Today, some of the most spiritual people I know claim to be without religion."

-Tony Campolo
"Mystical Encounters for Christians"
www.beliefnet.com

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"He saved us in order that He might begin to transform His world into the kind of world that He willed for it to be when He created it. … When Jesus saved us, He saved us to be agents of a great revolution, the end of which will come when the kingdoms of this world will become the Kingdom of our God”

-Tony Campolo
"It's Friday but Sundays Coming", page 106

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"Our call is to be God’s agents, to rescue not only the human race but the whole of creation.”

-Tony Campolo
TEAR TIMES, “Why care for creation?” 1992

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"...Isn’t God’s message to sinful humanity that He sees in each of us a divine nature of such worth that He sacrificed His own Son so that our divine potentialities might be realized? ... The hymn writer who taught us to sing “Amazing Grace” was all too ready to call himself a “wretch” ... Forgetting our divinity and over-identifying with our [Freudian] anal humanity... Erich Fromm, one of the most popular psychoanalysts of our time, recognized the diabolical social consequences that can come about when a person loses sight of his/her own divinity ...”

-Tony Campolo
"Partly Right" 1995

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“What I am trying to say is that Jesus who incarnated God 2,000 years ago is mystically present and waiting to be discovered in EVERY person you and I encounter”

-Tony Campolo
"A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 171

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“I do not mean that others represent Jesus for us. I mean that Jesus actually is present in each other person."

-Tony Campolo
"A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 192

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“That a new humanity will be brought forth from this Christ consciousness in each person."

-Tony Campolo
"A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 65

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“One of the most startling discoveries of my life was the realization that the Jesus that I love, the Jesus who died for me on Calvary, that Jesus, is waiting, mystically and wonderfully, in every person I meet. I find Jesus everywhere."

-Tony Campolo
an address at Prestatyn in the UK, 1988

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“There is a feminine side of God. I always knew this ... It is this feminine side of God I find in Jesus that makes me want to sing duets with Him ... Not only do I love the feminine is Jesus, but the more I know Jesus, the more I realize that Jesus loves the feminine in me. Until I accept the feminine in my humanness, there will be a part of me that cannot receive the Lord's love. ... There is that feminine side of me that must be recovered and strengthened if I am to be like Christ ... And until I feel the feminine in Jesus, there is a part of Him which I cannot identify.”

-Tony Campolo
"Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88

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"going to heaven is like going to Philadelphia....There are many ways....It doesn't make any difference how we go there. We all end up in the same place."

-Tony Campolo
"Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88

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"Anyone who resists the notion of women preachers is functioning as a tool of the devil."

-Tony Campolo
opening session of the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship's general assembly June 26, 2003

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"When in fact we live in a society that makes life hell for gays and lesbians, this community has got to stand up and say, 'We're on your side as you struggle for dignity,' and, 'Yes, we will defy anybody who says otherwise, even if we have to go to Disneyland to prove it.'"

-Tony Campolo
"Campolo: Opposition to women preachers evidence of demonic influence"
Jun 27, 2003, By Gregory Tomlin,Baptist Press

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"I have already made the point that we need to have to win people to Jesus Christ, but we must also preach the whole Gospel which not only calls people to love Jesus but to bring His justice into the political and economic arena in which we live."

-Tony Campolo
"Campolo: Opposition to women preachers evidence of demonic influence"
Jun 27, 2003, By Gregory Tomlin,Baptist Press

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"On the other hand, we are hard-pressed to find any biblical basis for condemning deep love commitments between homosexual Christians, as long as those commitments are not expressed in sexual intercourse."

-Tony Campolo
"20 Hot Potatoes Christians Are Afraid To Touch", page 117

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"One of the meanest arguments against public schools comes from alarmists who contend that public school students can be forced to study under homosexuals and might even be subjected to homosexual seduction. This contention makes me furious - not because I believe there are no homosexuals in the public school system, but because of the implication that homosexuals are some kind of special threat to children."

-Tony Campolo
"20 Hot Potatoes Christians Are Afraid To Touch", page 84

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"I'm not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians."

-Tony Campolo
Charlie Rose show on January 24, 1997



----WOW! If you need more, I'm sure I can find more but I believe this ought to be plenty to convince any true christian to avoid Tony Campolo at all costs. How can a christian hold up Tony Campolo as a mentor with comments like these, especially someone who is involved in teaching the youth?

-KTO

The Cloud of Unknowing

Ray Yungen Speaks on The Cloud of Unknowing

"To my dismay, I discovered this 'mystical silence' is accomplished by the same methods used by New Agers to achieve their silence, the mantra and the breath! Contemplative prayer is the repetition of what is referred to as a prayer word or sacred word until one reaches a state where the soul, rather than the mind, contemplates God. Contemplative prayer teacher and Zen master Willigis Jager brought this out when he postulated:

Do not reflect on the meaning of the word; thinking and reflecting must cease, as all mystical writers insist. Simply sound the word silently, letting go of all feelings and thoughts.

Those with some theological training may recognize this teaching as the historical stream going back centuries to such figures as Meister Eckhart, Teresa of Avila, John of the Cross, and Julian of Norwich. One of the most well-known writings on the subject is the classic 14th century treatise, The Cloud of Unknowing, written by an anonymous author. It is essentially a manual on contemplative prayer inviting a beginner to:

Take just a little word, of one syllable rather than of two. With this word you are to strike down every kind of thought under the cloud of forgetting.

The premise here is that in order to really know God, mysticism must be practiced–the mind has to be shut down or turned off so that the cloud of unknowing where the presence of God awaits can be experienced. Practitioners of this method believe that if the sacred words are Christian, you will get Christ–it is simply a matter of intent even though the method is identical to occult and Eastern practices. From A Time of Departing, p. 33, 2nd Edition

Just a Few

This daily devotional from the Institute for Creative Research is encouraging for pastors who are not obsessed with the HUGE MEGA CHURCH deal but are content to minister to small churches and allow God to be responsible for the increase.

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"The Lord did not set His love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people" (Deuteronomy 7:7).

Modern people -- even Christians -- tend to measure success in terms of bigness. God's measure, on the other hand, is based on quality, not quantity. There were undoubtedly millions of people on the earth, for example, when the Flood came in the days of Noah, but only "few, that is, eight souls were saved" as the waters lifted up the Ark (I Peter 3:20).

A few centuries after the Flood, populations had again increased, and great nations had developed in Egypt and Sumeria and elsewhere. But God called one man, Abraham, to establish a new nation, and Abraham obeyed. A number of great nations (Arabs, etc.) came from Abraham, but again God chose only one -- Israel, to inherit the promise. Israel did grow, but as our text shows, even this chosen nation was nearly always insignificant compared to other nations.

In Israel's history, many instances are recorded when God used just a few to battle many. God used Gideon's 300 men to defeat 135,000 Midianites (Judges 7:7; 8:10). Similar deliverances occurred in the days of David, Asa, Jehoshaphat, Hezekiah, and others.

In the New Testament, the Lord Jesus told His disciples that "where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them" (Matthew 18:20). He also said to them: "Fear not, little flock; for it is your Father's good pleasure to give you the kingdom" (Luke 12:32).

God's criterion is that of motivation rather than multiplication. "Strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it" (Matthew 7:14). But those few will be faithful servants and will someday hear Him say: "Well done, thou good and faithful servant . . . enter thou into the joy of thy Lord" (Matthew 25:21). HMM

CONTEMPLATIVE SNARE COLLECTION

This is a collection of previous posts dealing with the issue of contemplative prayer. We're calling it Contemplative Snare. The purpose of this is to help anyone interested in researching this topic further to do so with a bit more ease.

• CONTEMPLATIVE PRAYER VIDEOS

• I Want to Feeeel God

• Christians Should Dump Contemplative Prayer

• Contemplative "Prayer" (but is it really prayer?)

• Altered State of Silence

• Spiritual Disciplines

• We Live in an Age of Mysticism

•Real Prayer vs. Contemplative Prayer

•Contemplative Spirituality and Demonic Forces

• Should We Wait in Silence?

• Lectio Divina

• Mystics Misuse of Scripture

This post will be linked on this site and will be updated as new posts get added.

-KTO

CONTEMPLATIVE "PRAYER"--But is it really "prayer"?

Dictionary definition of the word PRAY:
v.
1. To utter or address a prayer or prayers to God, a god, or another object of worship.
2. To make a fervent request or entreaty.
3. To utter or say a prayer or prayers to; address by prayer.
4. To ask (someone) imploringly; beseech. Now often used elliptically for I pray you to introduce a request or entreaty: Pray be careful.
5. To make a devout or earnest request for: I pray your permission to speak.
6. To move or bring by prayer or entreaty.

Where do you see "meditate" or "listen" or "centering" or "breathing" or "feeling"?
Let us not be fooled. If you are meditating, listening, centering (whatever that is) breathing, babbling (Matt. 6:7) or feeling don't call it prayer. It is not the same thing.

The word PRAY means to ask. Simply put. Prayer to God is to go to him to ask (Mark 11:24) request, petition with thanksgiving (Phil 4:6. 7), plead, beseech, cast your care upon (1 Pet. 5:7), weep, yearn, praise. Jesus gave us the Lord's Prayer (Matt. 6:9, Luke 11:2) as a guide. He did not give us contemplative "prayer" (to use the term loosely).

1 Corinthians 14:15 tells us to pray with our spirit and with our MIND. We must be watchful and thankful (Col. 4:2). The mind must always be careful, watchful, cautious and focused on to whom we are praying with requests to God. Why? Because God knows that there is a universe full of deception and we are always at risk. Watchful, mindful, sincere, constant, supplication and petitioning to God as demonstrated in scripture is how the peace of God, which passes all understanding, keeps and guards our hearts and minds in Christ Jesus (Phil 4:6. 7).

We have no business trying to add, alter or revise God's method of prayer.
Finally; 1 Peter 4:7. "The end of all things is near. Therefore be clear minded and self-controlled so that you can pray."

-KCO

REAL PRAYER vs. CONTEMPLATIVE PRAYER

A couple of weeks ago I received an email from Christine A. Narloch of EARNESTLY CONTEND.COM. She had been reading some of the posts on thinkerup and made me aware of a body of research she had compiled where she has compared contemplative prayer methods to how prayer is actually taught in the bible. Her research is biblically solid and clearly demonstrates how the subject of prayer should be handled as taught in the bible as opposed to the unbiblical methods of prayer being practiced by those promoting contemplative prayer.

Here is an excerpt...

"Contemplative Prayer is not Biblical prayer at all, rather it is a type of mystical meditation leading the mind into an altered state of consciousness. It goes beyond thought, providing an experiential union with so-called God or with nature producing body sensations, feelings, images, and reflections.

It is based on “experiences” rather than sound doctrine. “… give attendance… to doctrine.” 1 Timothy 4:13. Faith is to be based on God’s word rather than experiences. “So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.” Romans 10:17, “For we walk by faith, not by sight:” 2 Corinthians 5:7.

Contemplative Prayer is also known as centering prayer, listening prayer, breath prayer, and prayer of the heart. It is just one of many mystical practices taught within a confusing, mixed-up movement called Contemplative Spirituality."

...READ THE ARTICLE.

-KTO

Contemplative Spirituality and Demonic Forces

For those of you who think all this fuss over contemplative spirituality and contemplative prayer is really no big deal, this story of Cassandrah Batya serves as a warning to what Satan can do to a person who opens himself up to unbiblical methods for attempting to reach God.

here is an excerpt...

"I cannot find the words to describe the experience I had that very night. I literally felt the evil presence of angry demonic forces surrounding our bed and knew they wanted to devour me. The demonic presence was so strong that I could actually sense where they were positioned in our bedroom and it was definitely more than one demon. To say that I felt panic-stricken and petrified with fear is an understatement..."
- Cassandrah Batya,

READ HER STORY